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Thread: GetIt Package Manager Restrictions



Permlink Replies: 5 - Last Post: Jun 6, 2015 6:36 AM Last Post By: Roy Lambert
Arnaud BOUCHEZ

Posts: 143
Registered: 2/17/02
GetIt Package Manager Restrictions
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  Posted: Jun 6, 2015 2:11 AM
Did you notice GetIt approval conditions: "Replacing key capabilities that are part of the core platforms definitions such as Client/Server FireDAC pack or the DataSnap/EMS Enterprise middleware, would be less likely to be accepted."?

It clearly remindsme the XE3 time where there was an attempt from Embarcadero to modify their licence terms, so that third party vendors or Open Source libraries would not be allowed to create multi-tier frameworks with Delphi!
http://blog.synopse.info/post/2012/09/03/Client-Server-allowed-back-to-XE3-pro

It sounds like a very closed mind spirit, especially to ensure the dynamism of a dev environment like our beloved Delphi.
Open Source libraries are what do make dev environments reactive and attractive.
Why restrain the extent of the official package manager?
AFAIK there is no such policy in MS Nuget, Ruby Gems, Node NPM...

IMHO Embacardero should better focus on the compiler and IDE, not cutting the branch on which they are seated...

See http://blog.synopse.info/post/GetItIfItWontHurtOurSells
Abdullah Kauchali

Posts: 28
Registered: 6/30/00
Re: GetIt Package Manager Restrictions
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  Posted: Jun 6, 2015 3:58 AM   in response to: Arnaud BOUCHEZ in response to: Arnaud BOUCHEZ

Hi Arnaud,

From your blog post:
"I guess our little mORMot falls directly into this "unwelcomed" category.
I did not make the submission yet. But should I?"

Short answer: Yes.

In fact, I would have first checked with Embarcadero before assuming anything and making that blog entry.
Arnaud BOUCHEZ

Posts: 143
Registered: 2/17/02
Re: GetIt Package Manager Restrictions
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  Posted: Jun 6, 2015 4:06 AM   in response to: Abdullah Kauchali in response to: Abdullah Kauchali
Abdullah Kauchali wrote:
In fact, I would have first checked with Embarcadero before assuming anything and making that blog entry.

The acceptance of mORMot is just a side effect - I do not care much of it being part of GetIt, since it is pretty easy to install.

The blog post is mainly about this statement:
Is it true that "strong client/server RDBMS integration require an Enterprise edition" ?
We will bias acceptance toward GetIt libraries that respect the spirit of our licensing and editions, not just use the letter of the license and the technical boundaries. If you are unsure about your submission please check with us first.
http://community.embarcadero.com/index.php/article/news/16027-submitting-libraries-to-getit

What the f..k is this "spirit of our licensing and editions"?
Why is it not part of the official license terms?
Where does this assumption comes from?
Would the licensing conditions change in the close future, as with the XE3 "episode"?
Would the Marco interpretation become the new rule?

Story repeats itself.
I just wanted to ensure that the licensing terms would not change in that direction.
I - as many Delphi users - would not let this GetIt "spirit" become the new rule.
Abdullah Kauchali

Posts: 28
Registered: 6/30/00
Re: GetIt Package Manager Restrictions
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  Posted: Jun 6, 2015 6:26 AM   in response to: Arnaud BOUCHEZ in response to: Arnaud BOUCHEZ
The acceptance of mORMot is just a side effect - I do not care much of it being part of GetIt, since it is pretty easy to install.

Ok, so say you submit it officially and Embarcadero accepts it, what then? Submit it and get an official response. Next move from there.

The blog post is mainly about this statement:
Is it true that "strong client/server RDBMS integration require an Enterprise edition" ?
We will bias acceptance toward GetIt libraries that respect the spirit of our licensing and editions, not just use the letter of the license and the technical boundaries. If you are unsure about your submission please check with us first.
http://community.embarcadero.com/index.php/article/news/16027-submitting-libraries-to-getit

What the f..k is this "spirit of our licensing and editions"?

The "spirit" is simply this: don't submit components that they deem will undermine the value Embarcadero is putatively offering to their higher-paying Enterprise clients. Components like DataSnap etc. (My personal take on this policy is that it is short-sighted. I would not agree with such a policy as it would be displaying strong-arm tactics which customers are always too sensitive about. It is sure to undermine trust about the GetIt ecosystem from the starting line. Your post is an example. Also, a policy like this is sure to introduce huge admin on Embarcadero's side: adjudicating whether a component is or isn't a canibalising alternative.)

Why is it not part of the official license terms?

I'm thankful it isn't, or that such restrictions got removed in the past.

Where does this assumption comes from?
Would the licensing conditions change in the close future, as with the XE3 "episode"?
Would the Marco interpretation become the new rule?

Story repeats itself.
I just wanted to ensure that the licensing terms would not change in that direction.
I - as many Delphi users - would not let this GetIt "spirit" become the new rule.

Let's hope it does not!
Roy Lambert

Posts: 1,063
Registered: 8/7/01
Re: GetIt Package Manager Restrictions
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  Posted: Jun 6, 2015 6:31 AM   in response to: Arnaud BOUCHEZ in response to: Arnaud BOUCHEZ
Arnaud

From a viewpoint of it doesn't apply to me becasue I can't see myself ever submitting anything here goes

I've just read the link you supplied. I think the short summary does a good job

This is the short summary:
Provide timely update upon RAD Studio releases
Offer "best experience" to RAD Studio developers
Consider it a trusted partnership
Have clean and modern code is a preference, not a rule
Support multi device and FireMonkey is great, but not required
Do not submit libraries that replace core Enterprise functionality
Avoid any Intellectual Property complaint

Bits of it are sensible but in the detail - you have to update your library/package within 30 days of the new RAD Studio release - consistently - twice a year!

<<Libraries with the best chance of acceptance should offer their "best experience and best support" for RAD Studio, focusing primarily on Delphi and/or C++Builder.>> to me this translates as either give opposing tools poor experience (ie poor quality) or don'r develop for them, and can someone explain just what "best experience" actually means in hard quantifiable terms?

<<Do not submit libraries that replace core Enterprise functionality>> As you surmise another attempt to push people into buying the enterprise edition - well they are in business to make money.

Overall it has the flavour of trying to set up a walled garden. <paranoia warning> Next stage - only packages / libraries downloaded from GetIt can be installed in RAD Studio - the rest of the ecosystem is dead </paranoia warning>

Roy Lambert

Roy Lambert

Posts: 1,063
Registered: 8/7/01
Re: GetIt Package Manager Restrictions
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  Posted: Jun 6, 2015 6:36 AM   in response to: Arnaud BOUCHEZ in response to: Arnaud BOUCHEZ
Arnaud

From a viewpoint of it doesn't apply to me becasue I can't see myself ever submitting anything here goes

I've just read the link you supplied. I think the short summary does a good job

This is the short summary:
Provide timely update upon RAD Studio releases
Offer "best experience" to RAD Studio developers
Consider it a trusted partnership
Have clean and modern code is a preference, not a rule
Support multi device and FireMonkey is great, but not required
Do not submit libraries that replace core Enterprise functionality
Avoid any Intellectual Property complaint

Bits of it are sensible but in the detail - you have to update your library/package within 30 days of the new RAD Studio release - consistently - twice a year!

<<Libraries with the best chance of acceptance should offer their "best experience and best support" for RAD Studio, focusing primarily on Delphi and/or C++Builder.>> to me this translates as either give opposing tools poor experience (ie poor quality) or don'r develop for them, and can someone explain just what "best experience" actually means in hard quantifiable terms?

<<Do not submit libraries that replace core Enterprise functionality>> As you surmise another attempt to push people into buying the enterprise edition - well they are in business to make money.

Overall it has the flavour of trying to set up a walled garden. <paranoia warning> Next stage - only packages / libraries downloaded from GetIt can be installed in RAD Studio - the rest of the ecosystem is dead </paranoia warning>

Roy Lambert

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